you are here: iVillage Pregnancy & Parenting Pregnancy & Parenting message boards Circumcision Debate  / Debate  / 

Circumcision Debate

102482 messages posted to this board • 3 messages posted today
find messages about   
welcome!
 
last visit to this board
Nov-23


messages posted
this board
190

add to friends
ignore posts
discussion title:
 

Medical benefits vs risk

emoticon:
 emoticon
message #:
  8308.1
replies:
  37
from:
  annkh
date:
  Oct-26 3:25 pm

It is important to remember that cirucmcision is surgery - a very common surgery, but still an operation.

Many parents declare that they choose circumcision for their son to reduce his risk of UTIs, penile cacner, STDs. But the evidence shows that circumcision does not PREVENT any of those things, and the reduction in risk is small (if it exists at all). But some parents insist that even a slight reduction in risk of UTI, or penile cancer, or HIV, is worth it.

But what about the risks of the operation itself? Why are some parents so concerned about reducig their son's risk of UTI from 1.5% to 1% (for example), but they seem completely unconcerned about exposing him to the risks of surgery.

The AAP downplays the risks, but still concludes that the medical benefits do not outweigh the risks.

Immediate risks of infant circumcision include excessive bleeding and "slip of the knife" errors. Babies don't have much blood to spare, and it doesn't take much blood loss (just a few tablespoons) to have devastating effects. There have been a couple of cases in the media in the last few years about babies bleeding to death from their circumcision wounds. And while accidents are not common, they can be catastrophic. Most folks have heard of the case of David Reimers, whose penis was so badly damaged during his circumcision that it had to be amputated - and he was subsequently raised as a girl.

The next complication to watch for is infection. Common sense suggests that an open wound wrapped in a diaper does offer the potential for infection. And with the high incidence of MSRA in hospitals, the severity of an infection can be very high.

Unlike many surgeries, where complications arise short-term or not at all, circumcision complications can develop years after the operation. Adhesions can form soon after the surgery, or as long as a year later. If left alone, adhesions will usually resolve on their own, much the way an intact foreksin eventually separates from the glans, but in some cases surgery is required to release them. If parents (or medical professionals!) break the adhesions, additional scar tissue can form. Since scar tissue is not elastic, phimosis or paraphimosis can result.

Meatal stenosis occurs in about 10% of all circumcised males, and is virtually unheard of in intact males. http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1016016-overview  In some cases, surgery is required to expand the opening, and if it goes untreated for a long time, urine can back up into the kidneys, causing additional problems.

If too much foreskin is removed, a man can experience painful stretching, even bleeding, during erections. Sometimes scrotal skin is pulled up the shaft of the penis ("hairy penis"). An uneven cut can cause unnatural curvature of the penis.

My question is this: what makes the medical benefits of circumcision so compelling that they outweigh the risks of bleeding, infection, accident, adhesions, meatal stenosis, removal of too much foreskin, even death?

Parents who have had sons circumcised - did your doctor discuss any of these possible complications with you?

last visit to this board
Nov-23


messages posted
this board
257

add to friends
ignore posts
discussion title:
 

Medical benefits vs risk

emoticon:
 emoticon
message #:
  8308.2 in response to 8308.1
replies:
  37
from:
to:
  annkh
date:
  Oct-26 4:34 pm

I think it's easy for American parents to gloss over the risks because of the fact that it is such a common surgery.  They think 'Why would doctors do it if it was so risky?'  There is also the common 'I've known x number of kids who were circ'd and they were just fine.'

We see this phenomenon in c-sections as well (not meaning to change the subject, just using it for a comparison).  Many women think nothing of scheduling a c-section out of convenience while glossing over the risks of such procedure because it's done so often, many women have no problems, and why would doctor do it if it was so risky.  Very similar concept.

<<Parents who have had sons circumcised - did your doctor discuss any of these possible complications with you?>>

Not at the time of the procedure.  None of this was mentioned to me.  During my 1st pregnancy they did do a bit about circ in our birthing class, but as I've mentioned on this board before they had a very neutral stance about it.  I don't remember any of the specifics that were mentioned, but I believe they mentioned the risks but downplayed them significantly.  Talked about them as if it was extremely rare.  I moreso remember them going through the procedure itself, talking about what would happen.  Of course, it was just sketch drawings to illustrate and I don't remember anything mentioned about infant pain/infant crying.  They did mention about the local anesthetic used but as I've come to realize it's about like throwing a drowning man a Barbie life preserver.

 

Siggy - Fall '08 Jan07 SB Phototag - 051309 - small rotating debate blinky
last visit to this board
Nov-23


messages posted
this board
308

add to friends
ignore posts
discussion title:
 

Medical benefits vs risk

emoticon:
 emoticon
message #:
  8308.3 in response to 8308.2
replies:
  37
from:
  itsirkmr  Member Icon
to:
date:
  Oct-26 6:20 pm

The ethics of performing a medically unecessary surgery without the consent of hte patient must be included in this weighing of risks vs. benefits.  IMO it makes it impossible to find that RIC is ever advisable or justified.

KristiHannahPiperJackson1.jpg picture by itsirkmr

"Belief is not required.  Once you know this story, you'll hear it everywhere in your culture, and you'll be astonished that the people around you don't hear it as well but merely take it in."  Daniel Quinn, Ishmael

ththintactbabyboy.gif picture by itsirkmrprobabies.gif picture by itsirkmr

March08blinkie.gif picture by itsirkmr

 

 


last visit to this board
12:53 am


messages posted
this board
251

add to friends
ignore posts
discussion title:
 

Medical benefits vs risk

emoticon:
 emoticon
message #:
  8308.4 in response to 8308.2
replies:
  37
from:
to:
date:
  Oct-27 1:25 am

"They did mention about the local anesthetic used but as I've come to realize it's about like throwing a drowning man a Barbie life preserver."

Goodness, Traci - that just about sums it up for me.

Circumcision and the issue of pain is ever-present: infant, first and foremost. That must be resolved before any other.

Grown men can cope with the pain, their choice or not. Forcibly circumcised boys have no choice at all. The pain and the lifelong effects of circumcision are theirs to live with and accept. They have no other choice. Both pain and blood, when experienced in everyday life, are the result of injury, infection or disease; but it's part of the inevitability of life. Unnatural injury is only ever a pre-requisite of surgery. What price inflicted circumcision?

Christopher

"Education is the discovery of our own ignorance." Will Durant

"Almost any manmade phenomenon is explained by tradition, inertia - or both." Anon

last visit to this board
Nov-22


messages posted
this board
869

add to friends
ignore posts
discussion title:
 

Medical benefits vs risk

emoticon:
 emoticon
message #:
  8308.5 in response to 8308.4
replies:
  37
from:
  jessjgh1  Member Icon
to:
date:
  Oct-27 10:17 am

<<Parents who have had sons circumcised - did your doctor discuss any of these possible complications with you?>>
This is a very good question for parents to answer.
I would be SHOCKED if these are mentioned, and I'd certainly appreciate knowing what parents do hear.... because it is very hard from me to think that parents know all this and still go ahead with the risks.

"There is also the common 'I've known x number of kids who were circ'd and they were just fine.'"
The thing is if you had a way to track these parents that say it was just fine immediately after birth to later, I think you'd find the answer changes.... Many parents 'forget' they had to deal with adhesions or even, just the apprehension they had at the time. Then some conditions do not really show up in infancy. As an example, meatal stenosis, may be diagnosed in toddlerhood and many parents are unaware that this is caused by the fact the child was circumcised.

From when I read over at the circumcision support forum these themes DO come up. Parents angry that they were not told proper care, apprehensive that had to deal with adhesions, parents making the decision to re-circumcise when the result wasn't what they expected, or parents just needing reassurance after making the decision. However, in 2 years are more, a friend may ask them and they will likely reassure them unless they completely change their mind.

Jessica

Photobucket>

PhotobucketPhoto Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

 Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at PhotobucketPhoto Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucketintact support    
Lilypie Third Birthday tickersLilypie Kids Birthday tickers
Change the number of messages
displayed on this page in
Indicate your interest in the discussion
   
Get updates to this discussion
delivered by email