Parents of an Abused Child

The tenth of April was my dads and brothers birthday. She was outside with my younger brothers, 9 & 11 and my newphew again. They kept asking me questions like if they could put her on their big bikes and push her around. DUH! Then out of sight into old vehicles and buildings that were dangerous and had who knows what in them. I told then no to everything and said she needed to stay in sight of the house so I could check on her from the window. Well after a few minutes all 4 of them were gone. They were playing in the woods. I yelled for them and they came right out. DD wears a diaper up there since I dont feel very comfortable with her yanking off her pants anywere like she does at home when she needs to go. There was no time for them to actually touch her because they dont even know how to put on a diaper on a child and there was no change in the way I had put it on.

ANYWAY, DS was born the 28th and has different parts that she has asked what is that DH and I are ONLY use proper words, penis and vagina. Today when I was changing him, she said "I see a dick". I pointed and asked her twice "what is that?" she said both times "dick". Then tried to explain to me something about guy, like maybe he was a guy and has a dick. We havent been able to get her to say anything else other than daddy when refering to other men with months of trying and other children including my brothers are babys. We ALWAYS correct her and say no that is a man/woman/boy/girl. We have thought she has said dick a few times in the last couple weeks (today it sounded like she called DH a dick) and know she has said guy a few times. Since we cant get her to say anything we repeat many times, and never use these two words, we wonder how she learned them and what made her pick them up so fast. We dont know my BIL that well. I worry about my brothers since every male born to my dad or his brothers has assaulted, or tried too, a girl or woman in or out of the family. I guess I am afraid of my dads influence on my brothers. Maybe they got as far as showing her their parts to her.?

DH said that maybe she asked my sister or BIL what nephews parts were and maybe this is how they explained it but I told my sister we use proper words only. And why would she be so quick to say them when we use other words that are said to her 3 or 4 times a day? Either way, we arent going to allow her anytime out of our sight with any of them and will greatly limit anytime with them period. Also, when I change her or clean her, she freaks anytime I get near her parts. She starts to fuss and push our hands away. maybe this is her independence or what we have been teaching her about her private spots, that nobody is suppose to touch. We never have any movie on with language on it, even if it is PG and only using suggestive comments she would never understand. Only cartoon, educational channels like discovery, and we are very selective in her movies.

Anyway, a little freaked that something may have happened. I dont ask her questions. Only listen to what she says and ask her to repeat it. What else can I do/watch for??? or am i over reacting.

*sigh*
Becky

It is entirely possible that one of the older kids used the word in front of your daughter and since she has reached an age where she is going to pick up curse words (or words that she THINKS are cursing) and use them for shock value (...i.e. to get a reaction out of mom and dad) the thing to do is to ignore the words that she is using and watch her *behavior* for indications of abuse.  The board website at the top of the page for the board lists the behavioral indicators that you should be watching for. 

Yes, it is possible that you are seriously over reacting.  And it is possible that you are too protective of your daughter because of your own history.  You need to *balance* your fears about what MAY happen with your daughter's soon to be increasing need for independence .  Give her the TOOLS that she needs to protect herself without smothering her by having to be there every second to stand guard over her.  When she starts school there are going to be friends, teachers, bus drivers and a whole host of *other* people who come into contact with her and SHE would feel angry and embarassed if you followed her around at school to protect her from what *might* happen (and quite honestly being over-protective can be as bad as being negligent/abusive). 

Second. If she had said dick as a swear word, than that would be one thing and I would understand that. Instead she said it regarding to a penis. The only way she would associate that is if she saw a penis and someone told her that it was a dick. Now I have only three questions. Who said it and How was it said? Did she ask someone what a penis was and dick was their responce? Or did someone say look/touch my dick? The thrid question is How do I found out the answers to the first two questions with a 30 month old?

Now there is a fine line with over protection. With MY side of the family there is no such thing as being too protective in my mind. My father, all three of his brothers, & almost all boys that came from or have alot of contact with these 4 men are child molesters, mothers father, & mothers boyfriend. Even my oldest brother (now 18) was taught at the age of 6 that is was healthy and normal to watch my sister and I in the bathroom and bedrooms through peep holes put in hidden spots for him. He was told if he didnt than it meant that he was gay! My younger two brothers have not been caught doing anything but their is plenty of reason to fear. My mother and her brother, my sister and one of my aunts are/were physically abusive to their children. 2 of my cousins dont know were to stop in their conversation when it comes to saying or expaining something that is inappropriate for children to hear. That leaves 2 cousins that I can fully trust! And you know what? Most of of the women and men in the family protect themselves and each other by saying that its not right to turn in family!!! and the women dont get their girls out of the situations and stay with the men! Tjey only say it is up to God to protect them. Well thats why God made parents.

DH's family is very small as his father never claimed him and his most of his mothers side never cared for him since he was born out of wedlock. So he has one brother, his wife and their two grown daughters he has little to no contact with, 2 divorced sisters he loves dearly, his ailing mother, his niece her fiance and her two sons, one ailing aunt, two cousins and a nephew and his three kids. He trusts most of these people EXCEPT his acloholic brother and his drug addicted wife, his nephew is unstable but would never hurt DD, and one of his nieces sons. His father, who cheated on and divorced DH niece, has pornography that we are well aware that the 6 yr old has seen/found. His grandfather is wierd too. I was concerned the since the time the boys father said something about sharing his mags with his father and that they have their own specail bathroom downstairs at his dads house were they sit on the back of the toilet. The 6 yr old has said weird and done odd things in the past that told us that DD should never be left alone with him.

That leaves friends. All my friends turned to the partying crowd even those my age who have kids. So we went are seperate ways. DH used to be big into drugs (has been clean for 8 years! and quit before we were togther) and part of his getting out of it was getting away from the people who would encourage him to go a stray. The few friends we have kept have all moved away and we dont see more than once a year. The other few friends we have made in the last 3 years have tried to get of of the two of us in bed or tried to tell us that the other was too controlling, violent, or a cheater. Hmmm??? We rarely argue and never have been violent to each other. The one time Dh got in my face to say something, I fliched from years of being abused from my mother. He broke down saying that he would never hit me and has been VERY concious about giving me space when we do argue. We are great at compromising and neither has cheated on the other. The one best friend we did share, was always telling us how much the other was so devoted and hoped to find a woman that he could share a relationship like ours with someday. If it wasnt for him, we probably would have seperated a long time ago. We havent even been close to him for a year since he also went the drug route. The way his life turned and his new friends werent appropriate for our family life and we moved on. So DD is never left with friends either. And strangers are out of the question. Including daycare settings since we have never understood why parents teach their children to not talk to strangers and then we leave them with group of them. Untill DD is able to talk well enough to inform us of bad things that may be going on, than she is only left with DH's sisters. We did the daycare thing once. She started exibiting many of the signs of abuse. We were never made welcome in the home and after threes weeks we pulled her out. The last day I took her there, I got their early so I could watch her interact with the other kids so that I could see what we need to work on with her socially . Aft er being kicked out, I went to DH at work crying that I was a bad mother. He went back to get her and after half an hour, she was still crying and was left in a crib alone in a bedroom. It took months before we could even leave her with DHS sisters that she saw all the time.

If I had family or a friend I could trust, I would be more willing to let her go. She could use the time with other adults other than mom and dad and other kids as well. She needs to learn to adjust to children her age. She is advanced and finds kids her own age boring and older kids dont want to hang out with a *baby*. She does get plenty of time with the 2 nephews who are 4 months younger and she loves them but doesnt care for other girls her age at all.

Sorry this for the rambling,
Becky

It is ok to ramble...I have done more than my fair share of it around here in the past.  Heck I have also done more than my fair share of yelling, screaming, venting, crying and yes even laughing around here as well. 

You may *never* get the answers that you are looking for to your questions.  Your daughter is 30 months old and children that age typically don't have the verbal skills to answer questions that aren't "yes" or "no" types of questions, although they generally have a vocabulary of a couple of hundred words. 

You may not appreciate my next suggestion but PLEASE bear with me while I explain.  I'm not sure that I wouldn't cut off contact with your family based on what your post said if I were in your shoes.  Your children don't *need* to be abused and it would be *healthier* for you as well from a mental health standpoint alone.  You wouldn't have to worry about whether or not someone was abusing her while she was out of your sight and it would lower her risk of being abused considerably.  I know that it is difficult to cut off contact with family members (I have done it *because* of how certain family members treat my 10 year olds) but I also know that my children feel safer and are happier NOT having contact than they ever were when they did have the occasional contact and *I* don't have to worry that Uncle R will decide to take it into his head to beat on one of my children or granny will make negative comments about them or Uncle S will molest one of them.  *I* still have the occasional contact with them because my mother has brain cancer and they occasionally show up when I am at mom's BUT my children do not. 

It most certainly IS right to turn in ANYONE who harms a child, or who you THINK has harmed a child.  I don't care WHO it is...if someone harms a child then they NEED to face the music and accept responsibility for their actions.  Protecting them at the expense of a child is, well, just plain WRONG IMHO. 

Do you and your husband attend a church?  I ask because churches typically have Sunday School and churches are *required* to check out anyone working with children pretty thoroughly so that they *don't* have someone working with children that has a history of abusing them and it would be a place where your children could meet and play with other children their ages in a supervised and safer setting.  It would also give you and your dh the opportunity to meet and possibly become friends with people who aren't as likely to be involved with drugs/alcohol.  Just a thought from the resident non-religious person. 

CONGRATULATIONS to your DH (Dear Husband)for having the courage to get clean and sober and stay that way.  Many people try and many people fail in that particular endeavor.  Staying clean and sober is a *very* big accomplishment and one to be proud of. 

My children have never been left with a sitter other than their grandmother or my older brother's wife although they did go to preschool for the socialization that it offers.  They started the fall that they were 3 and went for 2 hours a day 3 days one week and 2 the next.  The program that they were in when they were 3 was called Head Start (don't know if it is even still around) and when they were 4 we switched them to the STARS program offered through our local elementary school.  If you are planning on going the homeschooling route with your daughter you could look into the local homeschooling association (check  your local library...they generally know who in the area homeschools) and see if they have a playgroup for younger siblings which would also give her opportunities to socialize with other children. 

HUGE HUGS

I have pretty much cut off contact. Untill this last month, she has never left our side the few times we have gone up there. We teach her that it is wrong to sit on peoples laps, except Mom, Dad, and his sisters and that her butt is a private place too, even a loving pat is not acceptable. We do see my family on birthdays and Christmas being the only holiday. There are other reasons I dont go to see my family. My dad smokes 3 packs a day and doesnt me that he caused my asthma from 18 years of living in it. My moms place is as bad just because she has more than one smoker there. Both believe since they own their houses, they can swear and say/do whatever they want. I dont liek my children around those kinds of enviroments, the same reasons we dont have many friends.

I was going to start a different thread for this next story but I guess I will put it here. My mother was over to see the new baby a couple of weeks ago. The last time I had seen her was at my nephews birthday in the middle of March. My sister hadnt invited our grandparents since my gradfather is NOT a closet molester. He molested me under the table with one of my parents on each side and neither knew. He also gropes women and passes it off as accident or a joke. He does the classic going to bathroom, shuts the door for everyone to hear and then heads to the little girls bedroom stunt. Well my sister didnt want him there. My mom got ticked and asked her why and since she didnt want to drag her inlaws into it, she said that I didnt want him around MY DD. well itS the truth. Anyway, my mother, in front of my daughter, says that he sould be treated normal untill he does something wrong. I said he already has. She says all that is in the past and if the people had such a big deal about it, then they would have turned him in. She said that I shouldnt treat him like that for his feelings and should treat him normal untill he did something to me or DD. By now I had heard enough and didnt want DD to hear ANYONE supporting a child molester. I changed the subject before it became heated because DD would be more likely to remember that. Can you believe that? His feelings are more important than DD's innocence, mental/social/physical/sexual well being!!?? When I have the time alone with my mother she going to hear it.

Hmm... Im gonna put down thoughts. She said that my grandmother once took a bath with me as an infant and once kissed my mouth as one too. She went off on her saying how wrong that was. she told me these stories throughout my life. Then brought them up to try and tell me that I was being inappropriate with DD when she was a baby, sort of accusing me of possibly molesting her. I dont remember it all but her attitude was well I have dirt on you if I ever need to use it and Im letting you know it too. Anyway, she never talks about the things my grandfather did. Makes me wonder...

I do agree that it is alright to turn anyone in. If family hurts me or my own, they are saying that they dont care about the safety or well being of us. If they have such a deap lack of caring to do something like that, then they are not family. I would be turning in a stranger or aquaintance.

No church. I did go all the way through my teens. I went to 2 different churches. Churches have open arms to any kind of person, so I trust the people who attend the least. No they may not be teachers, but they may be still waiting in one of those dark rooms downstairs. The church teaches that God forgives all and give the false sense that the wrong act was ok. I was taught that in the house of God, I wasnt to fear or treat anyone differently. I wasnt allowed to feel uncomfortable or make a child molester feel uncomforatble because they needed God too. For example, I knew of a registered offender that went to sencond church I went to. IF he were to sit next to me, than is would be wrong to move for those reasons. Many also believe like my family that it is up to God to punish. Also, I watched other types of beliefs get ridiculed for not having the same beliefs, which I think is narrow minded. I grew up being taught that Catholics and Jews were bad in a church that supossibly welcomed all that worshiped God. In fact I felt I wasnt allowed to be friends with them either.

I believe that if you believe in a higher power, than you pray to the same God. AND, (this is very different but...) Both DH and I believe that God is a creator of evolution. How can a person believe we just are there but cannot believe that death is the end? The Bible says that it took God 7 days to create the earth. The Bible also says that 7 days to God could by 7 minutes or 7 million years, to him there is no time. Also he created everything in the same order that evolution said they came. So, in the end, It could have taken 7 billion years God to get to us. Or if you think a little more in deepth, 6 billion because on the 7th day God rested so we are in the last billion years. Then what? Why do we believe in God? Because it took great power to begin the first little piece of life that started it all. I have yet to find a church that would except that.

I would love to homeschool but feel more strongly the way DH does, public school prepares children for the real world as far as how to deal with people. There will be no head start or preschool since the studies just came out that they are no farther ahead by the second grade. The article I read said was more about how long time private school schooling has a lasting advantage, without paying to teach them when they are 3 or 4. Besides, they dont need that much socializing anyway, they learn what they need to know in kindegarden. I would just like to see DD interact more with kids her age. At my nephews Bday party, that I mentioned about, DD prefered to try and see what a couple of beetles on the windowsil were doing even with kids laughing and playing all around her. When she finally showed interest in playing, she wanted to play with the 10 year old group so she could learn what they were doing. The kids her age are too slow paced for her. I think that before I put her into school, I will have her tested because there is a great program here with a whole school for kids like her that match up the teahcers the students based on how they learn best. That way they end up in a class full of kids that think like them. The teachers say that in the end the kids teach each other. This is the best way so they can contiue to in junior high when they are mixed with the other school.

Mostly off topic and very long, sorry
Becky