Hot Topic: Sex & Spirituality

Why when people have stricter standards and a stricter moral code for themselves (faith or not) they are considered closed minded. (a negative term)  While people who believe in doing whatever they feel like whenever they feel like are considered open minded, (a positive term)

For example, people who want a monogamous marriage are in a closed marriage.  people who have sex outside of their marriage are in an open marriage.  why not use terms like faithful  or monogamous instead of closed?  Why do the conservative groups always have to have the negative conotations? 

Some of the opinions i have seen come up on these boards really baffle me.  Things I think most people think of as common sense.    

1. If someone has sex with someone of the same sex as well as the opposite sex and enjoy both but dont think of it as love, does it mean they are bi-sexual?    (Heterosexual people do not have same-sex sex........ever.  If they do it they are bi definition bi-sexual)

2. If they want to have sex outside on public property because thats what excites them, whats wrong with it?   

3. Someone wants to have a relationship with a married man/woman and then gets upset when the married person cheats on them too, ignores them to spend time with their family, or puts them second.  Gets jealous of the married spouse and questions why the spouse has a right to interfere with their affair.   Or worse yet, they are also cheating on their spouse and complain about their own spouse being clingy or having the nerve to question them or snoop on them. They think they have the right to happiness without leaving a previous relationship or worrying about another spouse, and family.

Why do people think they have the right to be happy at everyone else's expense?  When did the morality of the world lower to this level? Why is it that people who dont believe in cheating and sex outside the marriage become less enlightened and become considered closed minded and uninformed?

Sorry, on a rant today.   Our neighbor and his wife just filed for divorce. turns out he wants a threesome and according to him she is just too closed minded and unwilling to care about his happiness.  If she was any kind of wife she would do this for him so he is leaving her to find a woman who is more open and in tune with her sexuality.   It all just made me wonder that in a society where the current culture is to accept everyone and to not judge others on anything they do, is there truly no line that one can cause that makes their behavior deviant or wrong?  If people are just supposed to experiment with sex and do what feels good and everyone else is supposed to be politically correct about it, then absolutely nothing is too far or too crazy? There is no behavior that suggests a mental or emotional issue because if it makes them happy it has to be ok?  Sorry, i dont buy it.

amom, I don't think people who have a strict moral code for themselves are considered "narrow" or "close minded".  I think the issue comes when they expect others to follow their moral code, rather than allowing those other people the same courtesy of setting their own code.

As to whether "conservative" groups have a negative connotation, I think that is primarily a reflection that the majority of the news media is liberal to very liberal.  As a result, the media tends to portray conservatives with the same love most of talk radio portrays liberals.  No one likes to paint their opponents in a positive light.

As to your three examples, my comments:

1.  If someone is having sex with both men and women, I'd call them bisexual.  "Love" doesn't enter into the definition of sexuality.

2.  What is wrong with it (to my mind) is what happens when an innocent third party stumbles on it.  For example, there is a big brouhaha going on here in MA right now over gay men cavorting in the dunes of the Cape Cod National Seashore and being seen by the tourboats going by.  Honestly, if you're careful and don't get seen, I don't see a problem - no one is being hurt.  However, there is the potential of hurting innocent third parties.

3.  Extramarital affairs, to my mind, are damned messy.  If you have your spouse's consent, then fine, go have fun, but otherwise innocent third parties get hurt.

On the other hand, my basic view is that as long as no innocent third party is hurt, if its something you want to do, go ahead.  If you hurt yourself, it's just stupid, not wrong.

I don't feel people who have stricter standards for themselves and live by those standards are close minded, I feel people who are not tolerant of the beliefs and thoughts of others are close minded.   Open minded people are the opposite.  It doesn't mean they believe it for their own lives but they are tolerant of others who have a different opinion.

Bi-sexuality, we will have to agree to disagree on that one.   You and I have beaten that subject to death haven't we.   You have your belief and I have mine, it's all cool with me.   ;o)

I DON'T feel it's right to have sex in public, I don't feel anyone should have to witness people having sex and I don't feel anyone has the right to have sex where other people might stumble upon it.  If someone wants an audience for their sexapades or someone wants to watch others having sex, there are clubs designed just for that, they can go there and have fun with it.  I see nothing wrong with sex clubs, fetish clubs, they are there for those who want it and those who don't want it don't have to go. 

As for open marriages, having 3somes, group sex, etc.,  IMO that is a personal choice for each individual couple and I don't see where there is a right or wrong answer for it.   If a couple agrees to it, they both want it, then they should do what they want to do.  It's no one else's business what they do in their sex life, if their sex life is just between the two of them, if they have a lover on the side or if they have other people involved.  As long as it's consensual, that's all that matters.   (I'm not talking about anyone cheating)

Your neighbor divorcing his wife because she won't have a 3some, it's her right not to and it's his right to leave and find someone he is sexually compatible with if he's not happy and satisfied with his sex life.   I would not have married Dh if we weren't sexually compatible and have the same wants, needs and desires for our sex life the same as I wouldn't have married him if we weren't compatible in every other part of our relationship. 

As far as sex acts, I don't feel any kind of sex is wrong no matter how wild, crazy or kinky it is as long as it's not illegal and as long as all parties involved are consenting adults. 

What Dh and I do in our sex life other people might feel we're deviant, sick, perverted whatever.  They are welcome to their opinions and they don't have to like it.  We do nothing illegal, we do nothing that harms anyone else, everything we do is 100% consensual.  We like what we like and that's how we choose to live our life.  If others don't like the way we choose to live our life, well they don't have to like.  I don't care how others live their lives, if they have open marriages, if they belong fetish clubs, if they engage in group sex or anything else, it's none of my business what they do. 

JMHO 

amom - you put your finger on the issue:

whatever people did behind closed doors was their business.  If it's kept behind closed doors, it is their business.

As a poster on another site I frequent commented (and it's a board that might raise your hackles... lol)

I think conservatives, for the most part, don't give a [explitive deleted] what a person does behind closed doors as long as they aren't interfering in another's right to safety and security (i.e. committing a crime against another.) It's when what you do behind closed doors become a thing you must flaunt for everyone to not only know, but accept...that's when it becomes a problem for us.

I think that's a point we can agree on.

As for the media, for the last 40 years it's been against "traditional" culture.  Ultimately though, I think:

a) Everyone is responsible for their own behavior - You don't get blame "the media", "patriarchy", "poverty", or anyone else for how you behave.  YOU make your own choices.

b) As long as you don't hurt others (without their consent), you can do whatever you wish.  So I still believe whatever you do behind closed doors is your business.